<blockquote><h1>“Constraints often lead to the most creative solutions."&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;Let’s start with a short bio. How did you get into design?&nbsp;Donald Roos (DR): "I was born in Bloemendaal, a conservative but affluent town near Amsterdam, into a creative and entrepreneurial family. My father owned a photography studio, and my mother had studied art but stayed home. From an early age, I was drawn to creating my own projects. At 8 or 9, my friends and I made a school newspaper with typewriters and rub-on letters—we even sold ads in our village.I went on to study Graphic and Typographic Design at the Royal Academy of Art in The Hague. After graduating, one of my professors offered me a job, but after six months, I realized structured environments weren’t for me. The idea of fixed vacation days made me anxious, so I started my own design firm."

<blockquote><h1>“My typography background gives me structure, but I also love creative chaos.”</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;The need for freedom can sometimes clash with the realities of working in design. How do you balance the two?DR: "Freedom—or at least a sense of freedom—is crucial to me. I struggle with being in the same place every day, which is why I prefer working with freelancers instead of full-time interns. I want the flexibility to set my own hours.But with freedom also comes the need for discipline. It’s important to work on something every day—if not for a client, then on your own project. Working with freelancers keeps your team flexible and fresh. Especially for personal projects, it’s inspiring to collaborate with people who either do the same thing but think differently or do something different but think the same way.Of course, the downside of interns is that they’re there every day—even when you’d rather have a day to yourself. [laughs]"&nbsp;Talk us through your process: is it structured, or is it chaos?DR: &nbsp;"A mix of both. My typography background gives me structure, but I also love creative chaos. I start with quick sketches—pen and paper or iPad—so I don’t get caught in details too soon.The key is to start, and the rest follows naturally. If I’m in a creative process, I don’t mind some chaos. But it should be organized chaos—intentional and focused. Cleaning my workspace often helps clear my mind. Or my house... though the rest of the family doesn’t always appreciate that."

<blockquote><h1>"I'm like a creative ‘tractor’—just pushing forward."</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;How do you approach a new project?&nbsp;DR: "I sketch a lot. I'm like a creative ‘tractor’—just pushing forward. Early sketches get immediate feedback, helping determine if we're on the right track."&nbsp;Do all of your clients understand the early-stage sketching process?DR: "Not always. About 80% of the time, it’s fine. Another 10% need more guidance. The last 10% don’t get it at all—they think rough sketches are the final product! Some clients push the work in a better direction with their feedback, but others nitpick endlessly. In such cases, I sometimes have to say, ‘I don’t think we’re on the same page.’&nbsp;It’s not that the client is bad—it’s just not the right fit. And that’s okay. It’s better to acknowledge that early so they can work with a designer who truly gets them. But overall, I have great clients."&nbsp;Has AI affected your work?DR: "Not as much as in other fields, since most of my clients are creatives who value human creativity. I use AI for placeholders and rough concept visuals, but it can’t replace the creative process—it’s just a tool."However, I think AI will increasingly handle repetitive design tasks, freeing up creatives for more strategic thinking. That’s where human ingenuity still holds the edge."

<blockquote><h1>"People think creativity means thinking outside the box, but real creativity happens within constraints."</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;How does a typographer become an author?DR: "It wasn’t planned. I was always creating things—books, apps, designs. While discussing an app idea with a developer—something we were actually using for a studio I had at the time—we kept coming up with new ideas. But whenever we had another ‘great idea,’ we’d say, ‘Great idea, let’s not do it.’That’s when I realized that choosing not to do something is a powerful creative tool. That insight became ‘Don’t Read This Book,’ which was followed by ‘Don’t Buy This Book,’ and my latest, ‘If You Don’t.’And, of course, I couldn’t have done it without my partner in crime, Anne de Bruijn, who turned all my concepts and ideas into actual, readable books."&nbsp;Your latest book argues that sometimes doing nothing is the best choice. Can you elaborate?DR: "The title might sound passive, but it’s really about making conscious choices. For example, deciding not to fly forces you to explore other ways of traveling—ways that might lead to entirely new experiences you wouldn’t have had if you’d just taken a plane again. Constraints often lead to the most creative solutions.People think creativity means thinking outside the box, but real creativity happens within constraints. If you tell someone, ‘Make a painting,’ it’s too broad. But if you say, ‘Make a red painting,’ ideas start flowing immediately."

<blockquote><h1>"We’re living in uncertain times—things will change, one way or another… As creatives, we’re standing at a kind of blank slate, which also means there are opportunities."</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;Your book touches on sustainability. Do creatives have a responsibility to address these issues? &nbsp;DR: "It’s complicated. Creatives are often called in to ‘fix’ bad decisions made by those in power. Instead of finger-pointing, I see it as an invitation to rethink systems. Even small creative ideas can lead to change.We’re living in uncertain times—things will change, one way or another. Right now, we have to swallow some bitter pills. But in a way, I find that inspiring and challenging. As creatives, we’re standing at a kind of blank slate, which also means there are opportunities.Take something like not eating meat. You can see it as a limitation, or you can see it as a glimpse into the future. Meat consumption is unsustainable in so many ways—we all know it has to stop eventually. So why not start exploring what new possibilities open up when you leave meat out of the equation? Suddenly, a whole new world of flavors and ideas emerges."

<blockquote><h1>“We often accept systems without questioning them, but sometimes the most powerful thing we can do is to stop, reconsider, and choose a different path.”&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;Do you think privilege affects how people experience these changes?DR: "Absolutely. It’s easy to talk about sustainability when you’re financially secure. But if you’re juggling multiple jobs just to make ends meet, it’s simply not a priority. That’s why solutions need to be inclusive.I think many creatives don’t fully realize the privilege of being able to focus on creativity every day. Even if we’re not earning top-tier salaries by Western standards, we still make more than most people on this planet. That perspective matters."&nbsp;You say that sustainability is misunderstood. Can you explain?DR: "People assume reusable products are always sustainable, but that’s not necessarily true. A simple plastic bag might be more sustainable than a tote bag that requires huge resources to produce. We need to rethink how we consume, not just what we consume."&nbsp;Is your book a call to action or more of a thought experiment?DR: "Both. It’s not about telling people what to do, but about questioning why things are the way they are. We often accept systems without questioning them, but sometimes the most powerful thing we can do is to stop, reconsider, and choose a different path."

<img class="image_resized" style="width:25%;" src="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/1734005834646_71aac1e382.jpeg" alt="1734005834646.jpeg" srcset="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/thumbnail_1734005834646_71aac1e382.jpeg 156w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/small_1734005834646_71aac1e382.jpeg 500w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/medium_1734005834646_71aac1e382.jpeg 750w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/large_1734005834646_71aac1e382.jpeg 1000w," sizes="100vw"><img class="image_resized" style="width:25%;" src="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/1734005839502_8c5cc103c3.jpeg" alt="1734005839502.jpeg" srcset="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/thumbnail_1734005839502_8c5cc103c3.jpeg 156w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/small_1734005839502_8c5cc103c3.jpeg 500w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/medium_1734005839502_8c5cc103c3.jpeg 750w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/large_1734005839502_8c5cc103c3.jpeg 1000w," sizes="100vw"><img class="image_resized" style="width:25%;" src="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/Cover_Front_Y_Square_7cc1231044.png" alt="Cover_Front_Y_Square.png" srcset="https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/thumbnail_Cover_Front_Y_Square_7cc1231044.png 156w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/small_Cover_Front_Y_Square_7cc1231044.png 500w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/medium_Cover_Front_Y_Square_7cc1231044.png 750w,https://tioc-cdn.ams3.digitaloceanspaces.com/large_Cover_Front_Y_Square_7cc1231044.png 1000w," sizes="100vw">Donald Roos is an independent typographic designer and creative entrepreneur. He regularly launches new projects because he loves executing fresh ideas. His biggest problem is having too much to do and too little time, so he developed the To Don’t List method. Together with Anne de Bruijn, he wrote several books on the subject for BIS Publishers, which you can&nbsp;<a href="https://www.bispublishers.com/brands/donald-roos/">buy here</a>.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;

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Donald Roos is a typographic designer, creative entrepreneur, and problem solver whose work spans industries—from designing film titles for major motion pictures to crafting intuitive UI/UX experiences for startups. With a relentless drive to execute fresh ideas, Roos thrives on launching new projects. However, like many creatives, he often wrestles with an endless to-do list. This struggle led him to develop the "To Don’t List," a method designed to bring clarity and focus to creative work by prioritizing what not to do.&nbsp;In this interview, Roos shares insights into his creative process, the importance of freedom in design, and how constraints can actually fuel innovation. He also delves into sustainability, systemic change, and the surprising power of choosing to do nothing.

DONALD ROOS ON CREATIVITY AND THE POWER OF DOING NOTHING

<h1>Defining Creativity / Defying Labels</h1>&nbsp;Ask&nbsp;Sagmeister to define creativity, and his answer is characteristically unconventional: “There are very few things that bore me more in life than writing about definitions of creativity. I find the desire to define it a tad uncreative.”Fair point.Sagmeister’s refusal to box creativity into a neat little package speaks volumes about his approach—fluid, exploratory, and ever-evolving. When asked how he transitions so easily between disciplines, his reasoning is just as straightforward: “I get bored easily. So after a while, there’s always the urge to switch lanes.”However, he does acknowledge the long-standing debate on whether creativity is an&nbsp;innate talent or a&nbsp;skill that can be developed: “I always used to be vehemently on the muscle-training side of this debate and regarded innate talent as a myth. But after reading psychological research, I found convincing arguments that genetics play a significant role in determining a person’s well-being. If this is true, then perhaps the ability to perceive trends in design could also be a naturally inherited trait.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“There are very few things that bore me more in life than writing about definitions of creativity. I find the desire to define it a tad uncreative.”</h1></blockquote>

<h1>The Creative Process</h1>&nbsp;If creativity is indeed&nbsp;an inherited trait, Sagmeister seems to have inherited plenty of it. While some creatives adhere to&nbsp;strict processes, he takes a more&nbsp;relaxed approach, finding inspiration in his surroundings.He emphasizes the importance of&nbsp;workspace design: “A beautiful studio makes me work longer and harder, simply because I want to spend more time in it. A wide-open view that is interesting helps significantly with idea generation.”He also finds inspiration in&nbsp;motion and travel: “Taking train trips works well for me. The forward motion, combined with a view out the window and enough space for a sketchbook, helps generate ideas.”For Sagmeister, working away from the studio has its own advantages: “In a different place, thoughts about execution don’t come to mind immediately, and I can dream a bit more freely.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>"A beautiful studio makes me work longer and harder, simply because I want to spend more time in it."</h1></blockquote>

<h1>Risk and Failure in Creativity</h1>&nbsp;Dreaming is all well and good, but the harsh reality is that&nbsp;any creative endeavor has the potential to fail gloriously. And while failure is often romanticized in creative circles, Sagmeister challenges this notion: “Failure is overrated. The same people who talked about ‘thinking outside the box’ a decade ago are now discovering ‘the importance of failure.’”That said, he acknowledges that&nbsp;stepping outside his comfort zone has often led to&nbsp;success: “In most cases, when I go beyond what feels comfortable, things work out really well. My fears usually kick in far sooner than they should, and I’m convinced my work would be much better if I took more risks.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“I’ve never seen play reduce depth or meaning.”</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;One misstep he recalls involved making a&nbsp;last-minute change to a presentation, which inadvertently offended several people: “But such a case happens too rarely to even mention. The problem of staying on the safe side is infinitely bigger—it eliminates so much potentially good work.”Despite the risks, Sagmeister&nbsp;embraces playfulness in his work, believing that it enhances rather than trivializes depth and meaning: “I choose a theme or direction that is meaningful to me, and then I play within some parameters freely. I’ve never seen play reduce depth or meaning.”

<h1>Sabbaticals and Their Impact</h1>&nbsp;One of the&nbsp;most well-documented aspects of Sagmeister’s career is his practice of taking&nbsp;extended sabbaticals. These breaks from client work have led to some of his&nbsp;most acclaimed projects, including&nbsp;Things I Have Learned in My Life So Far and&nbsp;The Happy Film.Every&nbsp;seven years, he takes a&nbsp;year-long sabbatical to step away from commercial work and focus on personal exploration. These breaks have been&nbsp;instrumental in shaping his most introspective projects, reinforcing his belief that&nbsp;rest and reflection are essential to&nbsp;sustained creativity.&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“The first sabbatical was really scary—I had to overcome a lot of fear.”</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;Reflecting on his&nbsp;first sabbatical, he recalls considering a&nbsp;career shift into film directing. However, he realized: “It would be a 10-year process, and it seemed to make more sense to stay with the language I already knew—design—and see if I had anything to say beyond the purely promotional.”Was taking time off a&nbsp;risk? Not in hindsight: “The first sabbatical was really scary—I had to overcome a lot of fear (the studio being forgotten, clients leaving, etc.). But because that first sabbatical was so successful, the second was easy, the third even easier, and the fourth presented no risk at all.”Now&nbsp;mid-sabbatical, he finds himself working&nbsp;more than ever, but only on projects that genuinely&nbsp;interest him: “I work almost twice as many hours as I used to in the New York studio before the sabbatical. It’s very joyful.”

<h1>Advice for Young Creatives</h1>&nbsp;For&nbsp;emerging designers struggling to find their voice, Sagmeister offers&nbsp;practical advice: “If you’re fresh out of school, look for a design company that does the kind of work you want to do. Try really hard to get a job with them. Work your ass off. Then start your own place. It’s a great job.”For those&nbsp;hesitant to take a break, fearing it might&nbsp;hinder their progress, he shares a friend's advice: “Stop concentrating on your own happiness and start looking out for the happiness of others.”In a world where creativity is often seen as a solution to&nbsp;global challenges, Sagmeister offers a&nbsp;pragmatic perspective: “Ultimately, if your main goal is to change the world, design is not the right profession. Politics is. But designers can contribute an itsy bit here and there.”On his website, Sagmeister&nbsp;challenges the idea that design is purely about&nbsp;problem-solving: “Solving problems is for accountants and engineers. We can do so much more. We can delight! I can experience true beauty—whether looking at the New York skyline or the Austrian Alps. Considering it took nature 200 million years to form the Alps, but New Yorkers built the skyline in 200 years, I’m somehow more impressed with New Yorkers. The form of the Empire State Building does NOT follow function, but it functions much better than the 1970s skyscrapers built under the term of functionalism.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“If your main goal is to change the world, design is not the right profession.”&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>

<h1>Obsesssions</h1>&nbsp;In September 2008, Sagmeister and his team set out to create something bold, fleeting, and unforgettable. Over eight days, with the help of more than 100 volunteers, they meticulously arranged 250,000 Eurocent coins across a square in the heart Amsterdam, sorting them into gradients of copper and spelling out a striking confession:&nbsp;“Obsessions make my life worse and my work better.” Then, in a move as daring as the project itself, they walked away—leaving the shimmering mural unguarded, open for the public to engage with.What happened next was inevitable and yet, somehow, completely unexpected. Less than 20 hours later, a local resident spotted someone scooping up handfuls of coins, stuffing them into a bag. Protective of the art they had watched take shape, they called the police. But in a twist Sagmeister himself might have appreciated, the authorities—determined to “preserve” the piece—swept up every last cent and carted them away. Just like that, the artwork vanished.I was there, working as a press officer for the festival, and I still have a few of those coins tucked away in a junk drawer, a fact I relayed to the designer. His reaction was pure Sagmeister:&nbsp;“Ahhh, that is fantastic! I still like that project...” No frustration, no regret—only delight in the unpredictability of it all. That’s Sagmeister—more invested in the creative process than the permanence of the result. His work isn’t just about aesthetics or function; it’s about play, storytelling, and embracing the unexpected. And perhaps that’s the real lesson: true creativity isn’t just about what we make, but how we engage with the world around us. &nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“Stop concentrating on your own happiness and start looking out for the happiness of others.”</h1></blockquote>

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Designer&nbsp;Stefan Sagmeister has built a career on defying convention, bending the rules of typography, branding, and visual storytelling. From Grammy-winning album covers for&nbsp;The Rolling Stones, Lou Reed, and Aerosmith to provocative projects—including&nbsp;carving typography into his own skin—his work challenges the limits of design.Every seven years, he&nbsp;steps away from his New York studio for a year-long&nbsp;sabbatical, using the time to recharge, explore, and create on his own terms. For this interview, we caught up with him mid-sabbatical, bouncing between&nbsp;Mexico and Ukraine—technically on a break, yet still generous enough to share his time and insights. &nbsp;

THE CREATIVE MIND OF STEFAN SAGMEISTER: DESIGN, PLAY, AND PURPOSE

Disch attended the Art Academy before working as a graphic designer at LAVA design. Subsequently, he worked as art director and team lead at Edenspiekermann and GRRR. Currently, he’s the Design Director at Bravoure, a Dutch digital agency. He leads a team that mainly designs for the cultural sector, creating big digital platforms for music festivals and museums. In addition, he's a guest teacher at several colleges, co-founder of the Variable Font Course, and has a newsletter on digital design and typography. In short: he is one busy man, but thankfully found the time to sit with us and talk about the creative process.&nbsp;

You wanted to do the interview here at the NDSM; why is that? [NDSM is a former shipyard and up-and-coming neighbourhood in the northern part of Amsterdam - Ed]JD: “Imperfection is essential to my work. Nothing is perfect here and that feels comfortable to me. In communication and design, you need imperfection. Our job as designers is to create memorable stuff. In order to be remembered, you want to stand out and be different from the competition. So imperfection, things that are a little weird or out of the norm, help to make something memorable.”

What is your definition of creativity?&nbsp;JD: “Creativity has to do with knowledge - you need to know your stuff - and it has to do with imagination and reflection.&nbsp;You need a couple of ingredients to foster creativity. The first one is play. Feeling free to play is essential when coming up with ideas, because when you play you're in a much more creative mood than when you're focusing on other things, like results. I allow my designers to experiment and fool around a bit.&nbsp;You also need boundaries. If a brief or project is too vague or broad, it will not work. You also need to set boundaries in time and space. I usually advise my designers to go somewhere else: get out of the studio, go to a cafe to work or stay home and lock yourself up in a room where no one will disturb you. Also, give yourself a strict deadline. Decide what you will focus on that day and stick to that deadline. And don’t forget to allow time for reflection. We set aside time at the studio and then reflect on a project we’ve done.&nbsp;Every creative person needs boundaries. As designers working with clients, we are trained to work within certain limits, but at the same time, we try to step out of that frame and find new combinations of existing elements. That’s where creativity comes in.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“Feeling free to play is essential when coming up with ideas, because when you play you're in a much more creative mood.”&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>

How do you apply creativity in the work you do?&nbsp;JD: “There are different phases in the creative process. When working on a new project, you always start with research. You dive into the subject, collect all these ideas and images, and create a collection of knowledge and inspiration. And then you stop. The biggest enemy of creativity can sometimes be inspiration. That might feel counterintuitive, but my experience is that collecting inspiration for too long will block the creative process.Once you’ve concluded your research, the really hard part comes: resisting the urge to start designing straightaway. It’s very tempting to start thinking about solutions, especially for designers, because that’s what we are trained to do, but it’s vital that you don’t.&nbsp;The next phase is chewing on the material you have gathered. How do the different parts relate to one another? How can I combine stuff? What ideas can I work on? Chew on your material, then let it rest and do something completely different because that's the moment where your unconscious comes in. Things can take hours, days, and sometimes weeks to grow in your unconscious mind. But you will find that once you start working on the project again, ideas will pop up. And then it’s time for the final phase where you refine your ideas. Show it to others, improve on it, make it better.”Could you elaborate on the unconscious? It feels elusive, something that you have little control over.&nbsp;JD: “The unconscious part is really just a phase in the creative process. So first you collect stuff, then you chew on the material, and then it needs to go to your unconscious mind and sit there while you do something else. For example, a lot of people get the best ideas while cycling or taking a shower. In those moments, you are physically active, but your mind can wander. And that’s when ideas pop up. You don’t have to do anything for it; it just happens naturally.”

Isn’t there an inherent tension between allowing time for the creative process and running a studio that involves things clients and strict deadlines?JD: “It’s a tough combination for sure. On the one hand, there's a deadline; on the other hand, you want to have the time to explore new ideas. There’s the certainty of the process and how it works, but there’s also this big unknown in that you don’t know what the end result will be. You just have to be confident that your process is correct.”Has your view on creativity changed throughout your career?JD: “When I look back at what I did 20 years ago, it's more or less the same as what I do now. My role changed, but what I do and the way I do it are still the same. However, my perspective has broadened with each new job. When you start out as a designer, you tend to work solo and are really focused on the project or client at hand. As a design lead, you open yourself up to more perspectives. You open up to clients by thinking with them instead of for them. You're much more open to your team as well and even to society at large.”

<blockquote><h1>“I have this internal drive to do better, I think most creatives can relate to this.”&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>

If what you do, in essence, is the same thing, how do you keep it from becoming repetitive?JD “Challenging myself is not that hard because I'm never really satisfied with what I’ve done. I have this internal drive to do better, I think most creatives can relate to this, and so I see each project as a new opportunity to do better.I also keep pushing myself to learn things. For instance, five years ago, I started the newsletter Halfvet, which is about digital design. It allows me to reflect on what I see and form an opinion. I always look for topics that interest me but that I don't know a lot about, so it's a way for me to learn about this topic."You also work as a guest lecturer: any advice for the next generation of creatives?JD: “As a student, I did a lot of different things, which really helped me find out what I'm good at. I studied graphic design but also worked with video and film. And that gave me a lot of different options. And if I could give one piece of advice to current students, it would be to take your time and not rush through it.&nbsp;It’s nice when you can find one focus point, one thing that really interests you and own that. It can be a specific field of interest or a tool you master. Trying a lot of different things while also having one specialisation really helps you focus your career and be visible to others.And finally, your career consists of phases, just like any creative process. So you start out as a student, get exposed to many different things, and work in other disciplines. And that’s good. Be inspired, try different things. It’s okay that in this phase of your career you don’t yet know what it’s all about. That will become apparent later. Trust the process.”&nbsp;<a href="/profile/jeroen">Check out Jeroen's TIOC page here.</a>

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Jeroen Disch has over 15+ years of experience in branding and digital design. He's worked for renowned agencies, has a deep love for typography, and is the driving force behind Halfvet, a bi-weekly newsletter about digital design and typography. A conversation about the need for play, boundaries and trust.&nbsp;

Typography

DONALD ROOS ON CREATIVITY AND THE POWER OF DOING NOTHING

THE CREATIVE MIND OF STEFAN SAGMEISTER: DESIGN, PLAY, AND PURPOSE

JEROEN DISCH: TRUST THE PROCESS

Typography

DONALD ROOS ON CREATIVITY AND THE POWER OF DOING NOTHING

THE CREATIVE MIND OF STEFAN SAGMEISTER: DESIGN, PLAY, AND PURPOSE

JEROEN DISCH: TRUST THE PROCESS

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