Let's dive right in: do you think creativity is fixed and innate, or is it something that can be trained and explored?&nbsp;KW: "There are different theories that you could apply to this. There's one theory that is related to this idea of systems. Humans are a kind of system, and all of us are composed of all these other systems like the brain and the digestive system. But, at the same time, we're also part of more extensive systems, like societal and economic systems. Gordon Pask coined the conversation theory. The idea is that it takes two people, two actors, to interact with language and actions. But the key to that system is feedback. And so, the theory is that creativity always relies on some feedback mechanism, which could consist of thoughts we form in our head or feedback between two different entities.&nbsp;There's another theory by philosopher Daniel Dennett, who said that it’s not just people who create things, nature does as well. He looks at this in terms of design, so humans are intelligent designers, but according to Dennett, nature also undertakes this creative process through evolution. And that kind of creativity equals competence without comprehension.&nbsp;So where we, as humans, might be able to reflect on and comprehend the things we make, nature is doing the same thing through trial and error. Without, as far as we know, any intelligence or comprehension. In that definition, nature is also creative, and some people believe that all our creativity is just mimicking what happens in nature."

Does that mean that animals are also creative?&nbsp;KW: "In that definition, yes, because they're adapting to their surroundings and to things that happen to them, either during the lifetime of one animal or over a more extended evolutionary period. Another philosopher, Emanuele Coccia, thinks of this in terms of plants. Each plant is not only adapted to its specific environment but can also change that environment in some ways by creating flowers, releasing pollen into the air, etcetera. And the same applies to humans. We're not just part of our environment; we can also change this environment. We can't, however, be separated from this environment. Think of fish. You can't take fish out of the water; it's their environment. The same goes for humans and our need for air. When we breathe in, we're taking in some part of our environment, of the world around us. When we breathe out, we give back some part of ourselves to the world. So in that sense, we're inseparable from this world.&nbsp;Coccia argues that taken from his perspective, a fish is not so different from the environment it lives in. A fish is merely a different version of the water, a more solid version. It becomes interesting when you think about humans and creativity and this idea that intelligence is not just something inside our heads but distributed in our environment. For example, when I have to remember to take out the trash, I place the trash by the door. That way, I don't have to think about it anymore. The information is now in the environment. It's not in my head anymore. So that raises the question: how can we be creative by responding to and changing our environment?&nbsp;And to return to this idea of systems: look at a company like Google. When companies like that grow to a specific size, they cannot be so creative anymore. And so when they need new ideas, they have to hire people with ideas or buy smaller companies doing interesting creative things. They're bringing in creativity from the outside and introducing it into their own system."

You're a creative person using different means of expression, from theoretical writing to poetry. How does that work?&nbsp;KW: "I don't always intend to write poetry. Sometimes it just comes naturally. The same happens with ideas for an article. The best time for me to write is in the morning when I'm fresh. A Ph.D. student of mine said the best time for him is in the evening: after a couple of glasses of wine, he can be more creative. We're taught to work according to the clock, and in reality, we all have different stages of the day when we're more productive or creative. And those stages can differ per person.”&nbsp;

Left: Leonid Pasternak, The Passion of Creation. Right: Modern version of Pasternak's work made with AI.The technological world of AI and the world of poetry seem so far removed, but in your work, they aren't, are they?&nbsp;KW: "So I'm working on this current project where we use AI to help us structure a narrative. And we tried to train the AI system using poetry. So I copied and pasted these poems into a text file. A lot of poems. And I did this for a whole day, not even reading the poems. And I was looking at these poems all day, and by the end of that day, I felt like I was seeing the world as a kind of poem. Everything I saw, every object and every action: somehow, it came to me as a kind of poem, which was interesting. As if I became programmed by poetry. It’s not unlike what writers say: if you want to be a writer, you have to read a lot.”

It’s about input then. Which, brings us to AI. How do you think AI will effect creativity?&nbsp;KW: "I currently only use it to generate some unexpected connections, some randomness or some noise. Let’s go back to Alan Turing's original paper on Computing Machinery and Intelligence. In it, he talks about a classroom. Students can learn what a teacher wants them to, but true intelligence, and maybe we can say the same for creativity, is when we introduce something new, something different, something random. He says that for a machine to create something new, you must introduce some randomness or noise into the system.&nbsp;Some say that AI can never create anything new because it only knows what has been put into its system. But potentially we could train AI systems, which is what I’m currently looking into. Can it create something new and interesting that we wouldn't come up with ourselves? I urge my students not to just put in a prompt and then use the images generated, but instead use those images as a starting point. ChatGPT, for instance, is not very good at writing, so you can use it, but only as a first draft. You will need to do something else and use your knowledge and intuition to shape that text into something else. So I think it should be a collaboration."

Is human creativity still relevant in the future?&nbsp;KW: “If you define creativity or intelligence in a very narrow way, it's just a mental process that we can model somehow using an AI system. But to me, creativity is not just inside the head. It's not only a mental thing, it's also embodied. And that's where the difference is. So AI is good at doing digital things, things that exist on the computer and the Internet. But we live outside of the digital world as well.&nbsp;When I'm drawing something happens to me that's not just mental. It's the actions that I'm undertaking with my body. So we will always have this difference from machines in that sense. Now if machines were able to execute code and have a kind of memory, then it can start to have some actions in the world. And if it can execute code, if it can iterate and improve on its code, if it can start to be autonomous somehow, it can begin to impact things happening in the world.”&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“To me, creativity is not just inside the head. It's not only a mental thing, it's also embodied.”&nbsp;</h1></blockquote>

Some people say the main difference between AI and humans is that humans have the urge to create an AI. But now you’re telling us that AI could have some autonomy.&nbsp;KW: "Yeah, well, the question is: can it have its urges? Can it have desires? I don’t see that happening. Then again, I spoke to a robotics engineer some years ago who created this super simple and tiny insect robot. It only has like two or three components. It has a light detector like a photocell and a capacitor. To store up the charge that it collects from the light. And that's it. And then the little motor moves it, so all it does is where it detects more light, it moves towards the light. So so this. Super simple system. It already has some autonomy because it's seeking out the energy, the morning, so it can perpetuate itself to survive. So maybe there's something there?&nbsp;There's one theory of creativity by this guy named Graham Wallas from the 1930s. And he said that you must first collect all of this stuff. All these visual references and things. But then. What you do is go to sleep. And you know if you're working on a problem late at night or something you need to sleep on it. I do this with programming. I'll be trying to figure out what the hell is wrong with my program. And then I wake up in the morning and realize I was missing a semicolon somewhere.&nbsp;Now I asked ChatGPT about this. I said sleep is essential for creativity, ChatGPT agreed. I asked for some research to support this claim. ChatGPT said there was a 2013 paper about this and another paper, but it didn't give the exact references. Then I asked if it could become more creative. Could you sleep? Do you sleep? And it said, of course: ‘I don't sleep. I'm an AI system. I'm just running all the time.’ And I said, well if you could sleep, you could be more creative. But I don’t think he got it, haha."

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With AI being a hot topic, we turned to Kevin Walker to discuss AI and its implications for creatives. Walker, an Associate Professor of Immersive Media at Coventry University, leads a research theme, focused on AI and Algorithmic Cultures at the Centre for Postdigital Cultures. His research encompasses the intersection of natural and computational systems (more about that later). And with a background in anthropology, art, and technology, he explores his findings in theory and practice through software programming, exhibitions, events, and performances, as well as academic and creative writing.

KEVIN WALKER: CREATIVITY IN TIMES OF AI

Where does your interest in creativity come from?&nbsp;BS: “As a teacher, I’m always trying to get students excited about the creative process. I push them to try new things and aim for originality, not just functionality. I want to unlock their creative potential. That isn’t always an easy task because you’re working in this big educational institution. But thankfully we have minors where I can facilitate creative growth in students.”What does that look like?BS: “Your level of creativity is linked to how your brain is wired but you can still influence things by opening yourself up to the creative process and to the uncertainty that comes with that. I for one always try to get out of my comfort zone. I try to be open to new ideas, work with people and move forward. And I urge my students to do the same. I also create the en environment that is conducive to creativity. Location is important: we have a studio at Amsterdam’s NDSM where we’re surrounded by all sorts of creative people: designers, artists, etc.We also make sure that the group of students we work with is diverse in that we have students from various international programs and backgrounds. Research shows that having a diverse group of people benefits creativity and innovation. I’ll give you an example: I set up the minor Immersive Environments and here students are exposed to an abundance of inspiration and opportunities. We use all kinds of new techniques and materials, like projection mapping with sensors.&nbsp;

My role as a teacher is more that of a co-creator and together with the students I get to explore whole new fields. We invite experts in their own specific field, from art to philosophy, to give a lecture and share their knowledge. And we also select interesting project partners to collaborate with. We have students working on projects for museums, but they can also create retail experience for consumer brands. The students really get bombarded with a lot of information and inspiration in a short amount of time. By exposing them to all these different things students can find something that makes their creative hearts beat faster. They become intrinsically motivated to work on something and you end up seeing tremendous personal growth.”&nbsp;&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“Research shows that having a diverse group of people benefits creativity and innovation.”</h1></blockquote>

&nbsp;Working with other people. Sounds simple enough but it seldom is, isn’t it?BS: “You just need to beware of creativity killers. For instance, brainstorming in a large group never works. You really need to give people more space and time to reflect and come up with ideas. You also need a safe environment, one where there isn’t that much hierarchy or pressure. You want people to feel comfortable so they can express themselves. You can’t think big when you’re stuck in a small cubicle.” &nbsp;Why do you consider creativity a crucial 21st-century skill?BS: “AI can generate a lot of ideas and come up with a lot of different and new combinations. But we people still have our gut feeling. Our primal instincts help us determine whether or not something can have an impact on other human beings.Francis Bacon famously said that wonder is the seed of knowledge. I’d argue that wonder is often the seed of creativity. We need to hold on to this sense of wonder and we also need to believe that anything is possible. We’re facing enormous challenges and creativity can help create some much needed answers and solutions.”

&nbsp;Okay, so when you talk about challenges we’re thinking water shortage, climate change, economic disparity: to what extent can creativity help to ‘solve’ these big issues?BS: “In the Immersive Environments minor we’re mainly concerned with creating experiences, but these relatively ‘small’ creative exercises could very well translate into bigger things. You can take small steps and end up solving big problems. Working together is key. In our minor we have students from different backgrounds working together but they usually graduate by themselves. I’d love to change that and have students from art academies and technical universities work together on a graduation project. By bringing people from different disciplines together you get fresh perspectives and quite possibly the kind of creative solutions that we so desperately need.”&nbsp;&nbsp;Love that idea of a communal graduation project, but how realistic is that? Having a minor to experiment is one thing but what you’re proposing means cutting through a lot of red tape.BS: “I believe that even with a small group you can bring about a lot of change in education and learning experiences. Gradually, colleagues are also looking into this and together we’re trying to find ways to use new educational methods on a larger scale. Project education hasn’t really allowed much room for things like incubation of ideas and rumination time, which are extremely important in the creative process. I believe in design by doing. Learning about methods is one thing but there’s more to creativity than desk research and reading books: you need to test things and try things out. And not just at the end of the project, but throughout the project. You need to make things physical and visual in an early stage and then you can really start making progress.”

So why set up TIOC?BS: “I noticed that everybody is so busy doing their own thing that they don’t really know what’s happening in a different minor, let along a different school or country. I saw a lot of graduation shows and it struck me that many students were reinventing the wheel instead of building on what previous students had done. At Delft University you see the opposite with new students working on a new iterations of the solar car and with great succes! My goal is to make student work and their progress more transparent. The focus should lie less on an end product and more on the process of creative growth and the different ideas that students have. It's really just about showing creative growth. We interview experts about creativity. We offer tips, tools and training. We help to unlock creative potential, link students to companies, and set out creative challenges.”&nbsp;&nbsp;<blockquote><h1>“If you surprise yourself, you're already being creative."</h1></blockquote>&nbsp;Who is the target audience?BS “The platform is primarily aimed at students or young creatives who are still in their creative development. But anyone with a love for creativity and a willingness to learn new skills and link to other creatives is welcome to take part.”

Could you tell a bit more about the design challenges?BS: “We’re going to set out a number of design challenges, which are basically briefings that hopefully will excite students. One challenge will focus on how to design not for capitalism. How can you, in a society where almost everything is about making a profit, design for a better world? Another design challenge could be designing new experiences. Everybody is on their screen these days, which is a very isolated experience, but how can you create an overwhelming experience that people can enjoy, together, in one room?&nbsp; We’re also interested in asking students about coming up with new, immersive retail or restaurant experiences.”How do you feel about everybody jumping on the creativity train? Is there a danger of ‘creative washing’ with companies doing creative exercises but never really implementing change or unlocking their employees’ full creative potential?BS: “Like how design thinking has been embraced by the corporate world? I don’t see any immediate danger there. I would love for corporate giants to focus more on design thinking and really reevaluate the design process because that can lead to improved service design or better products. Creative growth isn’t necessarily easy to obtain, but it’s something that companies should aim for. Embrace creativity and allow for creative opportunities in your team.”Finally, what is your definition of creativity?BS: “There are a lot of different definitions that I agree with. One that resonates with me is this idea that you change your way of thinking and make connections that are new to you. If you surprise yourself, you're already being creative.”

Check out <a href="/profile/bart-jan">Bart-Jan's TIOC profile</a> for a portfolio of his work and his creative process.&nbsp;

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Bart-Jan Steerenberg (1975), designer, artist, teacher and founding father of The Institute of Creativity. For the past couple of years he’s been doing research into creativity at The Amsterdam University of Applied Sciences. As a result, he believes creativity is one of the most important 21st century skills, which led him to set up an educational platform on creativity.

Ai Art

KEVIN WALKER: CREATIVITY IN TIMES OF AI

BART-JAN STEERENBERG: FACILITATING CREATIVE GROWTH IN EDUCATION

Ai Art

KEVIN WALKER: CREATIVITY IN TIMES OF AI

BART-JAN STEERENBERG: FACILITATING CREATIVE GROWTH IN EDUCATION

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